tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post1504668053316539082..comments2024-03-09T00:51:33.602-07:00Comments on Little Catholic Bubble: From "awesome" gay lifestyle to Catholic: Marie's storyLeila@LittleCatholicBubblehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comBlogger328125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-14401802468079388442011-10-29T08:50:13.731-07:002011-10-29T08:50:13.731-07:00Melinda,
I admire you. I am a Catholic Mother, fo...Melinda,<br /> I admire you. I am a Catholic Mother, for many years my husband and I were Nominal Catholics at best. A few years ago I woke up, and have embraced the truth of our Faith. I spent a lot of time in confession confessing all the ways I failed, as a Catholic, as a mother, as a wife.<br />I stive now to live in truth because as someone said earlier in a post- knowing the truth, the beauty of it how could I do otherwise?<br />Unfortunately at this time my dear husband is living only for himself- a hedonistic life- he has separated from me- decided he never did love me- after 20 years together-thinks himself 'single". I remain committed and faithful to our sacrament and pray that he will come home someday and be the Father that our children need him to be. Our oldest daughter is a young adult- at 20 and has embraced hedonism also. For the past 4 years she has pursued relationships with other girls. She has stopped attending mass. I have joined an Encourage group for parents of those struggling with SSA.<br />we do not use the word Gay - it defines a person by the cross of sexual attraction. My child is a child born to love and serve the Lord. She for some reason has been given this cross of Same sex attraction.<br />Are you familiar with the Catholic apostolate "Courage" for those living with Same Sex Attraction.? Through carrying this cross- and still striving to live a chaste life that is pleasing to God- this is redemptive suffering.<br />I like the blog author was born in the mid 1960s- (1965). I grew up with God is love, be tolerant, accept everyone.. butterflies and kumbaya.<br />no real doctrine did I learn.<br />when my husband and I married in 1990 we heard maybe 5 minutes on NFP. no real reason was given on WHY artificial contraception is so wrong. In fact we were handed a paper from the US Bishops basicly saying one "could prayerfully make up your own concience.. about this issue" . recently I found it! <br />we never had read Humanae Vitae, the papal writings, the catechism.<br />as a result even though we started marriage using NFP after our first child was born it was on to the contraceptives. thus we only have two children. I grieve for the other children I might have had.<br />After my Father passed away from a long horrible illness- Alzheimers, <br />I began returning to learn about the faith.<br />we never actually Left the church- sure we went to mass every Sunday- kids went to Catholic schools.. but that was about it.<br />then my husband became more and more distant from me.<br />my oldest child started her first Same sex relationship.<br />I wanted to know what does the Church REALLY teach about all this>?<br />also several heretical liberal preists were giving erroneous bad advice, information to both my husband and I that I KNEW in my heart was wrong. My local parish has a so called "Catholic support group" for parents of gay-identified children. and one for the Gay identifying persons. These groups actually promote the homosexual lifestyle and condemn the churchs' teachings on so called gay marriage, on those in a same sex sexual relationship being able to to recieve sacraments as IF they are in a state of grace. I was shocked at what so called Catholic priests are saying is OK. thus I dove in to learn the truth. read what the Popes have to say about it.<br />If I as an abandoned- thus separated wife for 4 years now- get lonely and decide to "find' a new warm body to share my bed with- how could then even think that I could present myself for reception of our Lords body and blood in the Eucharist? I would be living in a state of mortal sin.<br />These same liberal priest also tells dear husband that somehow he too is in a "state of grace" and that abandoning his wife, his family has no bearing on his being a Catholic.<br />I dissagree. <br />how we love those the Lord has put to be our Family in this life has Every bearing on the way we show love to our Lord.<br />I am interested in reading more about your reconversion story.theresehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11369775824949574125noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-69471898693764307812011-07-22T17:55:45.451-07:002011-07-22T17:55:45.451-07:00we usually use two methods if we are during the mo...<i>we usually use two methods if we are during the most fertile time </i><br /><br />Mary, should making love be like arming oneself for battle?<br /><br />If there is a spiritual dimension at all to marital love, would the double methods and barriers in any way be antithetical to that?Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-33081948757516576802011-07-22T17:54:07.791-07:002011-07-22T17:54:07.791-07:00there is the chance we could conceive...and that w...<i>there is the chance we could conceive...and that would be very bad for several reasons. </i><br /><br />Would there be any good thing that could come out of a conception?Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-15885843851553321542011-07-22T17:20:57.976-07:002011-07-22T17:20:57.976-07:00Nubby,
You said, "Doesn't it seem at leas...Nubby,<br />You said, "Doesn't it seem at least worth a try to use nothing (but NFP), abstain for those few days or so of fertility, and be freed from all the trappings, not to mention cost, of contraception?" Others (MM) had that point. Well, first of all, husband would probably never do it---stranger things have happened...my father quit smoking after 50 years! Secondly, we don't really seem to mind our methods, as everyone else does. There is the environmental concern of all that wasted latex, but the fertility monitor strips are thrown away too. Also....there is the chance we could conceive...and that would be very bad for several reasons. If I was much younger, it would not be so bad, and even maybe desired if we hadn't then adopted...I do think people should start before thirty, but that gets back to my anger at RADICAL feminism, and my point to Andrew about having to live with your decisions, both bad and good, which seemed like good decisions at the time. And....never doing it again when I actually am most inclined seems like a huge negative, considering the fact that I don't agree that barrier methods or withdrawal are wrong.Marynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-17187292933894587132011-07-22T13:16:12.153-07:002011-07-22T13:16:12.153-07:00Bethany, oh how I wish I had your gift and patienc...<i>Bethany, oh how I wish I had your gift and patience with children!!! It is definitely not my gift, and I wish it were, with so many children living in my house, ha ha ha!! (My case just proves that God can work with anyone -- even me -- in helping to raise and form amazing people.)<br /><br />Anyway, you are my idol! :) </i><br /><br />*laughs* Don't praise me too much. Patience for other people's children I can do. But with my own it's a different story. I guess I have higher expectations for them than I do for other people's kids. <br /><br /><br /><i>Bethany....the word "sleeping bag" made me start to sweat!</i><br /><br />*laughs* Well the slept more on top of their sleeping bags rather than in them, but it is still hot. The air conditioner is set to 75 and it hasn't gotten below 80 in the house in the last 5 days. I can't wait till the heat wave, waves good bye.<br /><br /><i>That was nicely put...I will read it again..but, you said,<br /><br />"I don't get why there is this false understanding that abstaining from sex, even indefinitely, is a bad thing."<br /><br />Correct me if I am wrong, but the Church considers a sexless marriage a bad thing. <b>Also, I cannot think of a single man who would abstain indefinitely in a marriage without EXTREME issue. Not one.</b></i><br /><br />Well the Church would consider a unconsummated marriage, not a marriage. And simply not having sex, abstaining because a spouse is trying to be manipulative or saving up money for a new boat or a second home in Tuscany, or not wanting to appear weird or strange to their friends because all the friends have only 1 child, so they feel they should only have 1 child, none of these are good reasons to abstain from sex. <br /><br />But if the woman's health is on the line, or the financial burden is legitimately too great, or the emotional and psychological impact of raising many children could lead to mental health issues in one or both parents. Then no, the Church is not going to see not having sex as a bad thing. Though She will ask the couple to reevaluate their situation every so often to make sure that their abstaining is still for those just reasons. <br /><br />As far as not knowing any men who would abstain for that long: with the exception of the priests that I know, I don't know of any men who would either. But that doesn't mean they shouldn't. <br /><br />Because it's not about what they want either.<br /><br />It's always about what is in the best interest of the couple and family as a whole and whether we like it or not, the only person who truly knows what is in our best interest is God the Father. <br /><br />I feel like I just wrote something similar to this a few days ago. Either I have the gift of foresight (high unlikely, though I do get deja vu A LOT) or I'm projecting, again. *hangs head*Bethanyhttp://www.innocenceexperience.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-41971178646974415762011-07-22T12:08:39.311-07:002011-07-22T12:08:39.311-07:00Thank you, Leila, it was hard at the time, but I a...Thank you, Leila, it was hard at the time, but I am much happier now. Come to think of it, it really wasn't a marriage at all. At the time I married I had fallen away from the Church and so I married outside the Church. Lack of form is the term, I think. And my ex may have received an annulment (he is remarried to a Catholic). I have never gotten a copy of the decree of nullity..don't really need it.<br /><br />I have commented before, just not often.MaryMargaretnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-85155227827105832902011-07-22T12:01:25.461-07:002011-07-22T12:01:25.461-07:00Mary,
Glad to hear your husband has reverence for...Mary,<br /><br />Glad to hear your husband has reverence for you. You are pretty lucky. A lot of guys treat their wives the way they see women treated in pornography (to the point where they expect their mere touch will satisfy their bodily/sexual/emotional needs). As a man I find that shameful, cowardly, and terribly sad.<br /><br />Trust me when I say I am very, very happy for you.Andrew O'Briennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-21369911455185735382011-07-22T11:28:39.338-07:002011-07-22T11:28:39.338-07:00** before I was an educated, practicing Catholic.....** before I was an educated, practicing Catholic...Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-31985295440560042172011-07-22T11:27:03.305-07:002011-07-22T11:27:03.305-07:00That is, that we should not be dismissive of other...<i>That is, that we should not be dismissive of other's struggles. That was my concern here. </i><br /><br />Oh, thank you for this clarification! If I ever dismiss anyone's struggles, call me on it. Believe it or not, before I was Catholic I often dismissed others' struggles and thought they should just tough it out!! Now I understand the human condition (we are all broken and weak) so much better than I did before. That is what I love about the Church. She understands human nature and the human condition better than anyone. So much love and compassion there, and room for all. Endless, endless founts of mercy and understanding.<br /><br />I am so glad you finally commented!Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-9680231878968390082011-07-22T11:23:55.466-07:002011-07-22T11:23:55.466-07:00MM, I am sorry about the divorce, I truly am.
I j...MM, I am sorry about the divorce, I truly am.<br /><br /><i>I just wish sometimes, that this teaching was a little different. </i><br /><br />Do you think that your marriage would have been better if the Church changed her teaching? I'm still not quite understanding. After all, you said you did use barrier methods.Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-27078485795969618492011-07-22T11:22:31.237-07:002011-07-22T11:22:31.237-07:00MM, I agree! I was one who used contraception but ...MM, I agree! I was one who used contraception but would have never aborted a child. I think John Paul II said it well in Evangelium Vitae:<br /><br /><i>It is frequently asserted that contraception, if made safe and available to all, is the most effective remedy against abortion. The Catholic Church is then accused of actually promoting abortion, because she obstinately continues to teach the moral unlawfulness of contraception. When looked at carefully, this objection is clearly unfounded. It may be that many people use contraception with a view to excluding the subsequent temptation of abortion. But the negative values inherent in the "contraceptive mentality"-which is very different from responsible parenthood, lived in respect for the full truth of the conjugal act-are such that they in fact strengthen this temptation when an unwanted life is conceived. Indeed, the pro- abortion culture is especially strong precisely where the Church's teaching on contraception is rejected. <br /><br /><b>Certainly, from the moral point of view contraception and abortion are specifically different evils</b>: the former contradicts the full truth of the sexual act as the proper expression of conjugal love, while the latter destroys the life of a human being; the former is opposed to the virtue of chastity in marriage, the latter is opposed to the virtue of justice and directly violates the divine commandment "You shall not kill".<br /><br />But despite their differences of nature and moral gravity, <b>contraception and abortion are often closely connected, as fruits of the same tree. </b></i><br /><br />I wrote more about the inherent connection, here:<br /><br />http://littlecatholicbubble.blogspot.com/2011/01/contraception-leads-to-abortion-come.htmlLeila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-6761980030272058852011-07-22T11:17:50.542-07:002011-07-22T11:17:50.542-07:00Leila and Andrew, I am glad to see that you unders...Leila and Andrew, I am glad to see that you understand what I was trying (very badly) to say. That is, that we should not be dismissive of other's struggles. That was my concern here. <br /><br />I really enjoy the bubble, Leila. I read a lot but seldom comment.MaryMargaretnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-444454932525202582011-07-22T11:06:11.636-07:002011-07-22T11:06:11.636-07:00Leila and Andrew,
Thank you for your kind words. ...Leila and Andrew,<br /><br />Thank you for your kind words. Just in case I did not make it clear, my husband and I were divorced after 20 years of marriage (his idea). I have been divorced for 8 years, and the pain has largely vanished with time.<br /><br />Leila, although I do think that there is a statistical link between abortion and contraception, you simply cannot use them as equivalents. Many, many people who contracept would never have an abortion. And once again, I.am.not.saying that the Church's teaching is wrong in any way. I believe in the Church and I believe that she acts in our best interests. I just wish sometimes, that this teaching was a little different.MaryMargaretnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-40511936610180429622011-07-22T11:01:29.930-07:002011-07-22T11:01:29.930-07:00MM, point taken. I hope that we don't come off...MM, point taken. I hope that we don't come off as "telling Mary what to do". We speak a lot about free will here, and that we all have free will as a gift from God. The Church proposes, not imposes. Mary was a Catholic once, but now she is attending a Lutheran church, sort of as a deist? Mary can clarify.<br /><br />We definitely put forth the teachings of the Church here, as that is my original purpose of the blog. So, people who come here to discuss will definitely get our ideas and thoughts about why we believe in the Church and think her teachings are true.<br /><br />I love that quote from John Henry Newman!!Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-55045291073693680002011-07-22T10:57:04.134-07:002011-07-22T10:57:04.134-07:00JoAnna,
In my situation, you might be right. But ...JoAnna,<br /><br />In my situation, you might be right. But that is not Mary's situation, as far as I can tell.<br /><br />I know very well that the Church is not going to change her teaching on contraception. I have read about the teaching pretty extensively, and I struggle to understand it. "Ten thousand difficulties do not make one doubt" John Henry Newman<br /><br />Now, Mary has not said (unless I missed it) why she does not choose to use NFP. In any case, I am not comfortable telling other people what to do when I am free from that decision myself.MaryMargaretnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-37868186587973337162011-07-22T10:53:25.521-07:002011-07-22T10:53:25.521-07:00he has great respect and reverence for my body
Ma...<i>he has great respect and reverence for my body</i><br /><br />Mary, this may be way to personal, but what does this mean? What would great reverence for a woman's body look like?Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-62761762122445791322011-07-22T10:52:50.872-07:002011-07-22T10:52:50.872-07:00Mary Margaret-
Such a sad story. Thanks for shar...Mary Margaret-<br /><br />Such a sad story. Thanks for sharing. This teaching is truly difficult for so many people, as are many of the Church teachings. I apologize if I have personally come off been dismissive of these struggles. I assure, I'm aware. When we aencounter difficult teachings education and prayer are important steps. Contributers on this blog can do both of these things. What we can't do easily is share in the suffering and struggles that come about from following these difficult teachings. We can to a certain extent, but not as much as some of us would like to. There is just so much the internet can't do.<br /><br />God Bless. There is a lot of wisdom in your words.Andrew O'Briennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-47696228714011212742011-07-22T10:52:07.847-07:002011-07-22T10:52:07.847-07:00it seems to me that in your situation (and similar...<i> it seems to me that in your situation (and similar), the Church "okaying" condoms would be the Church saying, "It's absolutely okay if your husband emotionally abuses you by refusing to respect your body or your beliefs, because he wants it available to him for sexual pleasure 24/7." </i><br /><br />To further JoAnna's point, it seems likely that couples who practice NFP experience less “power tripping” over their spouse on the issue of sex as well as all the other issues in a marriage, because the view of marriage and sex (and all the other areas of marriage that require cooperation) is seen through a very different lens. I can say in my own life, the people I know who contracept have major power struggles in all facets of their marriage (money, child rearing, even “Me” time, etc). That’s not to say NFP’ers never argue or fight, but the mentality in general is one of giving rather than taking. There is more peace among those I know who use NFP, even if they’re busy and tired and/or on their 6th pregnancy, it’s not like the infighting I see among couples where one or both use a barrier. It seems to cause more angst than it’s worth.Nubbyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15972118374098863290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-80493930907640126112011-07-22T10:41:41.202-07:002011-07-22T10:41:41.202-07:00we usually use two methods if we are during the mo...<i>we usually use two methods if we are during the most fertile time </i><br /><br />Mary, should making love be like arming oneself for battle?<br /><br />MM, that is so sad, and I am sorry. I guess I would only say that the problem in the marriage seems to be something other than the Church's teaching on contraception. <br /><br />Think about it this way: Sometimes an abortion might "keep the peace", or watching porn. But does that mean the Church is wrong in her teaching about rightly ordered love, or does it mean that something has gone wrong in the expression of love in the marriage?Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-58156848647297913532011-07-22T10:37:34.350-07:002011-07-22T10:37:34.350-07:00Just an observation, but doesn't NFP seem much...Just an observation, but doesn't NFP seem much more liberating than worrying about employing correctly one or two methods of contraception?<br /><br />Doesn't it seem at least worth a try to use nothing (but NFP), abstain for those few days or so of fertility, and be freed from all the trappings, not to mention cost, of contraception?<br /><br />Just wondering.Nubbyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15972118374098863290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-91043045647029573352011-07-22T10:35:34.809-07:002011-07-22T10:35:34.809-07:00I don't know, MaryMargaret... it seems to me t...I don't know, MaryMargaret... it seems to me that in your situation (and similar), the Church "okaying" condoms would be the Church saying, "It's absolutely okay if your husband emotionally abuses you by refusing to respect your body or your beliefs, because he wants it available to him for sexual pleasure 24/7." <br /><br />Do you see how it would be very contradictory for the Church to take the above position while still having the teachings it does about marriage, and how husbands are supposed to love their wives as Christ loves the Church?JoAnna Wahlundhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09942928659520676271noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-32511828961898311172011-07-22T10:33:45.242-07:002011-07-22T10:33:45.242-07:00MM,
Thanks for speaking up. Also..I have serious...MM,<br /> Thanks for speaking up. Also..I have serious issues with the Pill for many reasons (go to great lengths to try to afford hormone-free dairy so why would I take hormones if there are other methods? (PS I suppose condoms can fail...never happened here...but we usually use two methods if we are during the most fertile time).Marynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-76366140112143360052011-07-22T10:32:46.827-07:002011-07-22T10:32:46.827-07:00Leila,
Yes, condoms or a diaphragm helped keep th...Leila,<br /><br />Yes, condoms or a diaphragm helped keep the peace. He was very demanding. This is all a long time ago, and I am no longer upset about it, but it does make me sad.<br /><br />I think what my story says is really, "Choose your spouse carefully!" :)<br /><br />I really, really wanted more children and he would not. Anyway, what I was trying to express above is not that the Church is wrong, but that these situations are difficult for many couples. My experience was also difficult, and I am not saying that my way of handling it was the best way or even a "good" way. I can imagine many other situations that would also be difficult and I certainly understand why couples want to use contraception.MaryMargaretnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-68807619718149316242011-07-22T10:30:31.266-07:002011-07-22T10:30:31.266-07:00Andrew....wish you could meet my husband...raised ...Andrew....wish you could meet my husband...raised by an agnostic and a strong atheist in a very loving happy home...(husband is somewhat agnostic...sorta zenish) My husband is one of the most empathetic loving people you will ever know...I don't know a single person who does not love him...he tries to be kind to all...in some ways he has been my rock...in other ways my greatest challenge to faith. We contracept...he has great respect and reverence for my body.Marynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-240447238522390484.post-73351528391654559482011-07-22T10:16:51.635-07:002011-07-22T10:16:51.635-07:00MM, do you mean condoms would at least keep the pe...MM, do you mean condoms would at least keep the peace, so he wouldn't get angry?Leila@LittleCatholicBubblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09357573787143230160noreply@blogger.com